289 REAR MAIN CAP CASTING NUMBERS

We always presume that caps with the 'screw-on' casting plates are Mexican. I wonder if some service replacements (or even originals) also had the tags. Like mine: #4 has c3oe on the little plate instead of a date code. Has anyone ever seen a Mex cap like that??

FWIW my set could be a mixed set- I picked them up at the local Shelby shop.

And the 2nd #4 cap (rear main) doesn't have the pin hole for the rope seal.

Rope seals were used up until 1969. Therefore all 289 HiPo engines should have rear (#5) mains with a pin to stablize the rope seal. With the split-lip seal of 1969 and later, the pin had to be removed. Anyone making a rear main after 1968 would not need to machine for the pin hole. This seems to lead me to believe that these caps we are looking at without pin holes are post-289 HiPo caps. Is it possible someone down in Mexico was making these after 1968 based on the 289 HiPo?

FWIW the date code on the rear Mexican cap I have is 31E2 and it has a rope pin hole. The cap is also cast with a "3" instead of a "5".

I have a NOS non mexican service replacement HIPO short block sitting in my shop. 6M date code. Yes, it is NOS and yes it was cast in 1966. No VIN stamped, nor the orange paint, obviously because it was never installed in a car. It does have the letters HP on the block. It is very faint, but looks to be a white crayon mark. If someone could tell me how to put PICs on this board, I will do that. Or one of you guys can send me your email address and I will email the Pics to you and then you can post them. Thanks Darrell hipocarnut@yahoo.com

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I have a NOS non mexican service replacement HIPO short block sitting in my shop. 6M date code. ...................

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Of course the 6M could indicate Dec 76

C5AE-6015E Block, which was purchased from Ford in Early 1967

Darrell,

Send them to me and I will add them to my website so they can be posted.

jschroeder66@verizon.net

Jim

Jim

Thanks for the offer to post the PICs. I sent the PICS to Bob Mannel last week and he said he would post them.

Here are the pictures of Darrell's block, connecting rods, and pistons. The crankshaft did not have the polished counterweight.

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-1.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-2.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-3.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-4.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-5.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-6.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-7.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-8.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-9.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-10.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-11.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-12.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-13.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/block-14.jpg]

Guys

Let me tell you the story as I know it. The NOS HIPO shortblock was bought from Ford over the counter in Early 1967. It was actually purchased as a Longblock, but the heads were used on another motor. Apparently Ford sold some of these performance parts on a regular basis back then (too bad they still don't sell these HIPO parts!). The guy that bought this from Ford built race cars. He used the heads on another engine (I have the heads also), took the shortblock apart, balanced it, then never put it in anything. He told me the crankshaft was stored since new in the upright position as to lay it flat could warp it. Whether or not it would warp could be one of those urban legends, I surely don't know. All I know is that I continued storing the crankshaft upright after I got it. Because the crankshaft did not have the polished area exactly like the PIC Bob emailed me, I got to thinking that maybe the guy borrowed the HIPO crankshaft and used it in another engine and maybe this was another crankshaft he bought new from Ford. BUT if the guy was so meticulous to stand it upright for decades, surely he knew where he got the crank from, i.e. the NOS HIPO shortblock. He was an extremely nice, honest guy and personally I believe his story. Is this a NOS HIPO crankshaft? Could Ford have put a non HIPO crank into this shortblock? Or maybe the guy that bought this new is getting old like me and getting a little forgetful! Regardless, there is no doubt in my mind that he believed what he was saying was true. Personally I believe him. He even offered to GIVE me a HIPO fan blade. I could kick myself now as the original HIPO fans are now worth quite a bit. Then again I could kick myself for all of the parts I chucked in my life because it wasn't worth the time to rebuild them. If I had only known then what I know now.

Thanks Bob for posting the PICS. Darrell

Darrell - Does the crankshaft have a 1M, 1MA, N or any other markings cast or stamped on it?

Darrell, FWIW I currently have a 67 hipo engine broke down. I believe too, that it was an over the counter replacement or "service" block. It has no stamped V.I.N. (none that I can find). I've traced it's history back into the late 80's (last machining) and when I purchased it, it came with all correct date coded parts. This would lead me to assume that it was a unmolested motor, that is the pieces were kept together. The crankshaft does not have a brinnel test mark. It's a 1M crank with several other markings, X's here and there, but no smooth rear journal. My other hipo cranks are early and have the test area clearly defined. Just for what it's worth...........

Darrell, thanks for the pictures. Neat to see the machining date on the oil pan lip and how close it is/was to the casting date. Do you have a shot of the assembly date from the top of the block?

Would help to complete the picture (time from casting - to machining - to assembly)

Edited by - J_Speegle on 01/09/2008 14:42:02

Fred

You are probably right on the Heads. There is no evidence that they heads were ever bolted to the block. They are dated 5K6 and 5K4 with a J040 stamped into them. Probably what they had on the shelf at the time the block was bought.

kar_nut

The Crank is a 1M. There are markings all over it. In addition there looks to be a write crayon mark (Like the HP on the block) on the rear counterweight. If you emai me at hipocarnut@yahoo.com I will send you some Pics. Then could you post them please?

Darrell

tater51

Thanks for sharing your info. No VIN would be present if it was purchased over the counter. Interesting about the Crankshafts.

Darrell

J_Speegle

Assembly Date? I don't recall seeing one. I will double check this weekend. Would there be one if it was an over the counter purchase? You got my curiosity up. Darrell

With all the interest in the crankshaft, here are Darrell's pictures

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-1.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-2.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-3.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-4.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-5.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-6.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-7.jpg]

[Blocked Image: http://www.fordsmallblock.com/Pictures/crank-8.jpg]

Keep in mind that standard cranks and 289 HiPo cranks came from the same molds, so will have the same markings from those molds. My sources tell me that 289 HiPo cranks were 100% inspected, meaning each one had to be polished on the rear counterweight for inspection under a microscope. I was told that the inspectors were given pictures of what the grain pattern density should look like under the microscope. If what they saw looked close to the picture, it was good. If it looked like another picture, it did not pass. I was also told that cranks that did not pass were scrapped (not used in standard 289s.) I can't confirm any of this. It comes from a guy who has been talking recently to some of the people how were in the foundry/engine plant during this time frame or on the 289 HiPo project. Memories can be weak, but it does fit the evidence. To date I have not heard of a documented unmolested 289 HiPo being taken apart and not having the polished spot on the rear counterweight. There can always be a first time, but I have not heard of it. What I continue to hear from sources closest to the plant is that the 289 HiPo cranks were not hardness tested (only inspected as described). And as far as I know, no Brinell or Rockwell hardness marks have ever been found on a 289 HiPo crank.