Posts by bobmannel

The 64½ Mustang in the Motor Trend article was a pre-production to show car magazine editors what was coming. Differences from production include C3OF-AJ carburetor with appropriate exhaust manifold with heat chamber (automatic choke), Fairlane 289 High Performance fender emblems, painted valve covers, small generator pulley. In short, it is a mixed bag. Has the California closed ventilation system. By June, when the production K-code Mustang came out, carburetors were C4OF manual chokes, deifferent fender emblem backing plates, and chrome valve covers.

everything is in the PDF Edition of "Mustang & Ford Small Block V8, 1962-1969" (www/fordsmallblock.com

Yes it is. The engine was assembled April 9, 1963 and the car's scheduled date was April 9, 1963.

Dynotech Engineering appears to be permanently closed, but if you could find another place, they could rebalanced the flywheel. Dynotech did that for me with a new 289/302 flex-plate for the 289 HiPo. What they did was temporarily added weights to make the flex-plate neutral. Then they added 2.2 ounce-inches at the counterweight, then removed the temporary weights which when added to the 28.2 made 30.4.

None of the fuel lines had real part numbers. They had engineering numbers and were service with 8C-2269-A bulk tubing and (1) or (2) 87944-S8 fittings. The 65 fuel line is in reproduction. Classic Tube has them under the part number MUC1003-OE (steel) and MUC1003-SC (stainless). They state it goes behind the distributor and the picture shows that. You can expect to have to "tweak" any reproduction line you get, but it will be close. (P.S. 64½ line is different, as is the 66 line.) Click on image to see the full length.

This year I will be at the Fairlane Club of America National Meet in Dayton, Ohio. The car will be there. As far as what has come to light so far, this is the only survivor of two -- the other crushed as a shell in Colorado decades ago. This car was ordered by Westside Ford Inc, 4755 Fauntleroy Ave SW, Seattle, WA (now an apartment complex with store fronts). I think it might have been a showroom display -- catering to the family customer (4-door) and performance group (HiPo) before steering family customers to milder engines, and the performance group to the hardtops. When I got the car, it had 63 chrome plated valve covers which were likely put on by the dealer for display dazzle. It was eventually sold on January 11, 1964 for about $1,950 (which was $1,000 less than sticker price) as a leftover model. The car sold for $400 in 1972 and was taken off the road in 1976 after being used as a daily driver for 94,000 miles. I bought the car in 1984 for $1,700.

They are just molding numbers. HiPo heads used molds 19, 20, and 21. The same engine can have different mold number on right and left heads.

Hi, all. I have not been monitoring the forum in quite awhile, but since Fred contacted me, I logged back in to make a post. I began the book project back in the early 1980s, finally self-publishing 5,000 copies in 1998. Although I expected to sell them all within a few years, then reprint, it took 26 years instead. The last ones were sold in December 2024. Sometime around 2015, I wanted to do a follow up and began working on a PDF Edition based on the book, but including all the corrections and a lot of additional information. I completed that in 2019. It was given away with each book sold after that and now sells for $25, just to cover my expenses. You can read all about the PDF Edition at http://www.fordsmallblock.com. The PDF Edition is not a PDF copy of the book. It includes links within that make navigation to the info you are looking for very quick. Much faster than you could do in the book, and much more additional information. In addition, I update the PDFs whenever new discovers, corrections, etc. are uncovered. In a sense, it is a "living" book. When you order it, you create an account of your own. This allows you to download replacement PDFs at no charge. You can always check the date of your PDF and compare it to the date given on my website. If your date is earlier than the one listed, you can log into your account, and download the latest version to overwrite your old one. I have attached a picture of my 63 Fairlane engine compartment and car. I bought the car in 1984 and finished the restoration last year.

Whenever you see a suffix after the last letter of the engineering number, such as A1 and A2, it means two different vendors are supplying a part under the same part number. The appearance of the part between A1 and A2 can be quite different. On rare occasions, the A and A1 on the part number might occur, but I have not seen it listed this way in the MPC, only on the actual box of the part. There are also occasions where instead of the A1 and A2 on the engineering number, it will have a different letter, such as A, B, and C. For example, C5AZ-6A666-A could be marked C5AE-6A666-A or C5AE-6A666-B. C5AZ-6A666-A1 could be marked C5AE-6A666-A, C5AE-6A666-B, or C5AE-6A666-C.

And it gets more fun. C6AZ-6A666-A was marked C6AE-6A666-B. But, it was for the big blocks in 1966, not the 289. Then in 9-67 (near 1968 production), the C6AZ-6A666-A part number replaced C5AZ-6A666-A. Since these valves were supposed to be replaced every 12,000 miles, the C6AE-6A666-B valves were getting installed on the earlier 289s. And, although Ford did not show different engineering numbers under the C6AZ-6A666-A part number, there were at least two I found -- C6AE-6A666-B1 and C6AE-6A666-B2. Both were different designs, each from a different company.

So, what should you use? You are safe with a C5AE-6A666-A, C5AE-6A666-B, or C5AE-6A666-C marked valve.

Fred, You are correct. C5AE-E was what I meant.

I started this project in 1981 after returning from an overseas tour of duty. The book was published in 1997. Work on the PDF version began a few years later and was released this past May. It continues to be an ongoing project. We never stop learning or hearing about new information.

The book no longer comes with a correction sheet because the PDF Edition serves that purpose. We all like a paper copy for reference, but as a practical matter, it is cost-prohibitive to publish revised editions. The PDF Edition allows the information to remain up-to-date and expanded at will. Plus, if anyone has used the PDF Edition, they probably have really enjoyed how rapidly the book can be navigated with the provided links.

Bob

The is only one edition of the book. Yes, there are mistakes in the book. Nothing too serious, but bothersome. For example, HiPo cranks were not stamped with hardness markings. They were visually inspected for nodularity -- hence the polished area on the early HiPo cranks. Also, C3AE-E heads are not HiPo heads. The PDF Edition has all the corrections incorporated. Plus, if new errors are discovered, new PDFs are posted, which anyone who has purchased the PDF Edition can download and replace that file for free. Details are on the website.

For those who do not know, a little over 6 months ago I came out with a new PDF Edition of my book "Mustang and Ford Small Block V8, 1962-1969". PDF has all the corrections to the book and supplemental info for all chapters. Appendices have been expanded. Full parts listing and illustrations of engine parts and accessories, including obsolete numbers. High Performance appendix very much expanded. PDF Edition is not a copy of an updated book, but one designed for rapid navigation with thousands of links. For details, go to my brand new website at https://www.fordsmallblock.com. If you own a copy of the book already, email be at bobmannel@charter.net and I will give you a coupon code to reduce the price by $14 of the "PDF only" purchase. When you order, you will create an account on the website which will allow you to receive free updates to the PDF Edition when they occur. Bob Mannel

I think my old account is bobmannel. If you find it, you can merge with my new account under the same name. Thanks!

Can you post a clear close-up picture of the 3939S stamping and the date code on the other flange?

C4OE-8505-A for generator (starting in June 1964)

C5AE-8505-C for alternator until around June 1965

C5OE-8505-B from June 1965 or a month or two (cast iron)

C6OE-A late 1965 production and all of 1966-67 production

All small-block starter motors from 1962-64 are the same. In 1965 Ford introduced the large flywheel which took a different starter motor (shorter nose). Only certain models received this new flywheel in 1965 -- namely Galaxies and Fairlanes. All others continued to use the older starter -- namely Falcons, Mustangs, and Comets. There was one exception -- the 1965 Comet 289 HiPo used the larger flywheel. But, all Mustangs, including the HiPo used the smaller flywheel and older starter. Automatics from 1965 all used the older starter, including the small-blocks with the larger (168/164-tooth) flex-plate. Only the Galaxie used this large flex-plate. All others used the smaller 160/157-tooth flex-plate.

So, the only cars to use the short-nose starter were M/T-equipped 1965/67 Galaxies, 1965/68 Fairlanes, 1966/68 Comets, 1967/68 Cougars, and 1967/68 Falcons with 2V. All Mustangs used the normal one.

For Mustangers, ask for a Mustang automatic starter and you should get the correct one. If you ask for a manual trans starter, its a crap-shoot as to whether they will get it right because it "depends" on too many little known factors.

The C5AE-6015-A is a bad number. All the early production 289-2V, 289-4V, and 289 HiPo blocks were C5AE-6015E.

All 289's used the 7" spread. You only have to worry about the 6" or 7" spreads on the 221 and 260 V8s.

Bill, Did you know any of the fellows that might have worked in the engine plant while the K-code engines were being assembled? There are a lot of questions about the start of the 289 HiPo production, and about when sequence numbers -- and later VIN numbers -- were stamped on the engine.

The only thing that matters is that no casting date code on any part of the engine is after the engine's assembly date code. As to how far in advance, it could literally be on the same day or any day prior. Within a couple weeks is nice, but could be anything. Engine parts could be delayed for any number of reasons (repair, for example) before showing up in the parts bins.

The engine assembly date could can also be after the car's door tag date code. The latter is a scheduled date and cars could easily miss the scheduled date. On my 63 Fairlane, the engine assembly date code and the car's date code were the same.