Carb Spacer

Milpitas_old · January 29, 2007 at 10:34 AM

I thought the HiPO had a different carb spacer with the PCV Vent blocked off?? Is this correct??

round2K_old · January 29, 2007 at 3:17 PM

Some hipos had PCV.

66KGT_old · January 29, 2007 at 4:35 PM

I believe 64-1/2's had the road draft tube, 65-67 had a PCV.

RalphJr · January 29, 2007 at 4:35 PM

Blocked off - actually NOT drilled plates were only used on cars with road draft tubes.

If the car received a PCV it needed the drilled spacer.

Milpitas_old · January 30, 2007 at 4:36 PM

Thats why I love this place!! Thank You!

bobmannel · February 28, 2007 at 11:55 AM

Road draft tubes were used from about May 1964 until March 1965 in states where they were allowed (California and New York required PCV). The spacer was either cast with no hole, or had a hole and was capped with a rubber plug and ring clamp.

MR.FORD49_old · March 2, 2007 at 8:29 AM

I believe you have that wrong. I have never seen a road draft intake that had a date code that was built for any 1965 Hipo engine,starting with Sept. 1964. And both of my 1965 Hipo's Dearborn Built had the plate with NO hole. They both had PCV system. The PCV hose was connected to the rear vacuum port in the back of the intake. All 65's had a PC system it was the LAW! And all 1965 HIPO valve covers had a PCV port. All 64 1/2 had road draft tubes except California DSO cars. I have seen San Jose cars with the PCV system using the spacer with the hole just like the do with the A code 289. I hope this helps. Ron

SixT5HiPo · March 2, 2007 at 12:04 PM

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I believe you have that wrong... All 65's had a PC system it was the LAW! And all 1965 HIPO valve covers had a PCV port. All 64 1/2 had road draft tubes except California DSO cars.

I strongly disagree. My February, 1965, engine has a road draft tube that is attached to the valve cover. The car is Metuchen built with DSO 23. Scheduled build date Feb 15, and dealer invoiced March 31, 1965.

round2K_old · March 2, 2007 at 12:57 PM

PCV was required by the California Air Resources Board in 65, but not by the EPA in other states. California was the first state to adopt emissions controls and they were not applied to 49 state cars until 66. The basic rule of thumb is that emissions controls that appeared on cars first sold in CA were followed in the 49 states two years later. This accounts for 65's with PCV in CA and road draft tubes on 49 state cars. Same thing with Thermactor systems; they show up on CA cars in '66 and 49 state cars later.

MR.FORD49_old · March 2, 2007 at 1:48 PM

You may want to check your date code on your intake. did you buy the car NEW? And it was the Law in all states to have a PCV system for the 1965 year. Not just Califorina and New York. My Feb 1965 Hipo had a PCV system and it has a DSO of 53 Kansas City. And my DEC. built 1964 has a PCV system and its DSO is 41 Chicago,ILL. I checked with the state of ILLINOIS and they required a PCV system since mid 1963. I had a 1963 Chevy SS with a PCV system and also a 1964 late Galaxie with a 289 V8 with a PCV system. Maybe differant factorys did differant things. Maybe a Level change? But I would check your date code to make sure. The fact is in your date code on your intake! Just trying to help. Ron

SixT5HiPo · March 2, 2007 at 2:36 PM

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You may want to check your date code on your intake.

I have verified ALL the date codes on the original engine, and they are well within the accepted timeline. The engine assembly date stamped on the block is February 15, 1965, which is the same as the scheduled build date of the car. This is why the car wasn't built "on time", and wasn't delivered to the dealer until March...

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

did you buy the car NEW? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

No...but I got the car from the original owner, who was 98 when he sold the car about 5 or 6 years ago. The engine and drivetrain is original, and has never been rebuilt. The engine id tag and all date codes match up.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Maybe differant factorys did differant things. Maybe a Level change? But I would check your date code to make sure. The fact is in your date code on your intake! <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

We already know that the different assembly plants are responsible for certain subtle variations that drive historians and MCA judges crazy...I am certain that my car has an original, unrestored engine and drivetrain. I have the oral history from the original owner, two build sheets, and original invoice to verify the timeline completely.

Mustang assembly at Metuchen began in late January or early February. The car's low consecutive number fits in with other documentated Mustangs from this plant, placing it in the proper chronological sequence. The only anomoly is the delay caused by HiPo engine shortages at that time. That is why the car wasn't delivered and invoiced by the dealer until the end of March. By the way, the car was ordered in December of 1964, when the original owner was a only 63 years old! It was his "daily driver", and he logged about 84,000 miles on the car. He wasn't a retired guy at that time, and worked full time well into his 70's, and continued driving the car until he was around age 97...

MR.FORD49_old · March 2, 2007 at 2:46 PM

Ok thats great. What is your date code on the intake? So what if it is a early date code. I don't care when the engine was built. All I'am saying is check the date code and it will confirm everything. You will then know that Ford used the parts they had at hand when that car was built.The parts at that plant may of been shipped there 6 months early, and they used those first. I'am not saying your car is not correct. You don't have to prove nothing to me just to yourself. What was built at that plant before Mustangs? Posible Fairlanes, Comets, or Falcons? Does the road draft tube exit right above the H-pipe or go around it? My 64 1/2 Mustang 260 coupe road draft tube went around the Y-pipe but hit the H-pipe when I put duals on it. Just giving info about my two Hipo cars. Ron

SixT5HiPo · March 2, 2007 at 4:16 PM

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What is your date code on the intake?<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Although I have memorized a lot of numbers, I do not remember the date code on the intake manifold. The car is presently at another location, but I expect to take it out for a drive this weekend. I promise to check the intake manifold date code if it will help clarify this.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

All I'am saying is check the date code and it will confirm everything. You will then know that Ford used the parts they had at hand when that car was built.The parts at that plant may of been shipped there 6 months early, and they used those first... You don't have to prove nothing to me just to yourself. What was built at that plant before Mustangs? Posible Fairlanes, Comets, or Falcons? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

The particular assembly plant where the car is built is NOT the place where the intake manifolds were installed. The 289 engines were completely assembled, including the intake manifold and carburetor, at the Ford Cleveland engine plant. They were test run, and then packed into containers for shipment to the various assembly plants. The accessories and necessary brackets were added at the assembly plant when it was determined which type of car would use the engine.

The Metuchen, NJ plant did not build Fairlanes. I don't know if any Falcons were made there. Mercury Comets were built there in 1965.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> Does the road draft tube exit right above the H-pipe or go around it? My 64 1/2 Mustang 260 coupe road draft tube went around the Y-pipe but hit the H-pipe when I put duals on it.<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

The draft tube is the correct HiPo style, and does not have any clearance issues with the exhaust manifolds or the H pipe. It carries a different part number than the standard V-8 draft tubes.

bobmannel · March 2, 2007 at 5:51 PM

There might be some confusion on terms and systems. First, some background. Since the 221 came out in late 1961 there have been road draft tubes and PCV systems at the same time. Both attached at the rear of the intake manifold, so this area was always machined. In 1964 Ford abandoned the road draft tube system and used the PCV that exited out the passenger's side valve cover. In May 1964, Ford revised the PCV systems. The 7-1-64 Mercury 1964 TSB #9B and 5-10-65 Ford TSB #15, Artcile 279, stated "Bascially, this revision involves the release of the 'Jiggle Pin' control valve for vehicles built or sold in California or New York, and the release of a road draft tube for the remaining vehicles."

This does not mean that all non-CA & NY vehicles got road draft tubes. It means it was released so that they could be used. Some got them and some did not. This affected the 64½ HiPo Mustang. When the road draft tube was installed, the intake manifold was machined as it had been in 1962-63. The tube attached there. This was done at the engine plant.

For 1965 production, Ford revised the road draft tube to attach to the passenger's side valve cover. This meant that there were no changes required to the intake manifold. The 289 HiPo took a special road draft tube so that it would clear the streamline exhaust manifold. The part number was C5OZ-6758-A. In addition, a special carburetor was used with the 1965 289 HiPo with road draft tube. It was C5OF-L tagged, although the carb base might be stamped C4OF-AL.

In the 5-10-65 Ford TSB #15, Article 279, it also stated "During March 1965, assembly plants will phase out the road draft tube crankcase ventilation system previously installed as standard equipment on some car and truck engines."

So, if you have a 65 HiPo from August 1964 to about March 1965, it could have a road draft tube, although most will likely had the PCV.

Hope this helps.

Edited by - bobmannel on 03/02/2007 17:55:12

Edited by - bobmannel on 03/02/2007 17:56:29

SixT5HiPo · March 2, 2007 at 6:33 PM

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So, if you have a 65 HiPo from August 1964 to about March 1965, it could have a road draft tube, although most will likely had the PCV.

Hope this helps.

It sure does! Thanks, Bob.

chucks302 · March 2, 2007 at 6:46 PM

I THINK YOU GUYS SHOULD MEET AT MY SPOT AT FORD CARLISLE THIS JUNE AND WORK THIS TOPIC OUT.

Edited by - chucks302 on 03/02/2007 22:40:46

MR.FORD49_old · March 2, 2007 at 6:59 PM

Thanks for making it more clear. This should help when the next book is done. It would be nice if all of owners that have K Mustang's should inform Marv what system you have and then we could see if it was due to which plant it was built. I know the engines where complete and tested before they where shipped. I hope we could add this info with the next HIPO Book. Bob thanks for helping out. I just never saw a 1965 Mustang HIPO with a road draft tube. Lets see what plants did use the road draft tube or a PCV system. Thanks! Ron

SixT5HiPo · March 2, 2007 at 8:20 PM

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I THINK YOU GUYS SHOULD MEET AT MY SPOT AT FORD CARLISLE THIS JUNE ...

Let's hope many of us can meet at Carlisle. That would be great! <img src=images/icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

gtk66_old · March 3, 2007 at 5:32 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

I THINK YOU GUYS SHOULD MEET AT MY SPOT AT FORD CARLISLE THIS JUNE AND WORK THIS TOPIC OUT.

Edited by - chucks302 on 03/02/2007 22:40:46

That sounds great,sorry,but I think I missed your space#.I live about an hour away and have a ton of questions.

Thanks

chucks302 · March 3, 2007 at 8:59 AM

[quote I wont have a space number until april when it is assigned to me.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

I THINK YOU GUYS SHOULD MEET AT MY SPOT AT FORD CARLISLE THIS JUNE AND WORK THIS TOPIC OUT.

Edited by - chucks302 on 03/02/2007 22:40:46

That sounds great,sorry,but I think I missed your space#.I live about an hour away and have a ton of questions.

Thanks

[/quote]

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