Restoration Opinions

garymcgowan_old · November 29, 2006 at 5:09 PM

Hello all.... I'm getting ready to start my restoration project and would like some opinions. My car has 44,000 original miles and the body is as rust free and straight as you can get. The interior (F4) is original and looks good... not new but darn good for a car of it's age.

The engine and engine bay are dirty and needs to be cleaned and detailed. The engine runs strong and does not smoke. I purchased all the parts from NPD today to completely recondition the engine and bay. I will start pulling the engine out tomorrow.

Question 1: Would you leave the interior as is or replace with new?

Question 2: Would you rebuild the engine regardless of how good it runs now?

Question 3: Under carriage was undercoated. Would you clean it off and restore to original color or just re-spray with under coat?

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks.... Gary

Joe6pack_old · November 29, 2006 at 5:58 PM

Hi Gary - I was sort of in the same boat as you, but I didn't seek advice. I wish I had.

If the interior is in good shape, I would leave it alone or only replace the parts I had too. Reproduction materials are obvious. I love the fact that my interior is mostly original despite the blemishes.

I personally would leave the engine alone. I rebuilt mine, but in retrospect, I wish I hadn't. The car only had 69,000 original miles and the engine ran great. K engines were built for robustness from the factory, so you should be in good shape. You may, as was my case, have a couple of cracked piston skirts. This is pretty common on original pistons, but I wouldn't worry about it.

As far as undercoating goes, it depends on what you want to do. Cars without undercoating definitely look better and cleaner. It can be alot of work to remove the undercoating, so for a driver, I wouldn't worry about it. Just touch it up and go.

I hope this helps.

garymcgowan_old · November 29, 2006 at 7:16 PM

Thanks Joe... Yeah, I think you are correct on the interior. Although, I have seen some really nice ones that were re-done.

I think I will pull the engine and pressure clean and paint it along with the bay and leave it at that. Do you know if the bell housing is also painted the same color as the engine?

Thanks, Gary

66KGT_old · November 29, 2006 at 7:23 PM

A rust free 44,000 mile car I'd be tempted to do nothing to it other than maintenance and aquiring some of the correct parts that may be gone. Unrestored can be good!

garymcgowan_old · November 29, 2006 at 8:42 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

A rust free 44,000 mile car I'd be tempted to do nothing to it other than maintenance and aquiring some of the correct parts that may be gone. Unrestored can be good!

Hmmm.... you bring up a very good point. Do you think I should just clean it up in the engine bay and not paint? The only parts I see that need replacing are the following:

1. Alternator

2. Windshield washer bag and hose

3. Battery (proper one)

4. Clutch (Current one requires a gorilla to depress it)

5. Transmission (Current one is a RUG?)

6. Coil

7. Proper Cap and wires

8. Maybe the exhaust (has new exhaust but I am unsure if it is correct for the car)

9. Oil Pan (Someone put a modified pan with increased oil capacity)

10. Remove long tube headers and install original headers that came with the car.

I think that is the only parts I would have to purchase and/or replace. Believe it or not it still has the original radiator cap. Maybe a new cap would be needed. <img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Thanks... Gary

66KGT_old · November 30, 2006 at 12:09 AM

I would start there and see what you have. Can you post or link to any pics of the car? We LUV pics! <img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

garymcgowan_old · November 30, 2006 at 7:44 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

I would start there and see what you have. Can you post or link to any pics of the car? We LUV pics! <img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

I should be able to accomplish all of the above with the exception of the headers and oil pan by this weekend. I will take some pics then and get them posted.

66kcar_old · November 30, 2006 at 11:33 PM

Sounds like you are on the right track. I wish my car was in your shape. Not too many left like that. By the way, what are your plans for the incorrect parts. I'm always building one car or another and might be able to use them. I'm in Vero Beach, are you nearby? I'd like to see a car like yours.

garymcgowan_old · December 1, 2006 at 7:14 AM

How far are you from Deland? Maybe we can arrange to get together. I'm not sure about the parts yet. I still have to decide if I am going to replace the "Tear Drop" hood and 3 duces. The 3 duces are supposed to be dealer installed when car was bought. No way to prove that one.

I have the original hood but it will need painting. I think I have the correct date intake and I have the original 4100 carb that came off the car. Not sure if I am going to go back original on the carb or not yet.

The last thing I have to decide on is do I want to change out the bell housing? I think it has a Lakewood on it now. The bell housing I have to replace that with is not date correct for the car and one of the pilot flanges are broken.

Looking forward to meeting you sometime in the near future.

Gary

RalphJr · December 1, 2006 at 11:57 AM

Gary,

I have 1 or 2 extra bell housings if you are interested. I know one has had the pivot point replaced - so you see the replacement screws instead of rivits but it is otherwise in nice shape - I'll have to check the other one. I can also check the dates - but the datecode won't show once the tranny is installed - so a "correct" date is only for your edification.

Send me a private email if you are interested and I can email you some picks.

Ralph

garymcgowan_old · December 1, 2006 at 5:45 PM

Ralph.... Actually the replaced rivits is probably better. As I remember from days long gone the rivits were a problem. I sent you an email.

Thanks

Beagle1_old · December 1, 2006 at 8:37 PM

Guess I'm not the only one with a Teardrop hood and Tri-power...here I thought I was being different when I did that [Blocked Image: http://home.comcast.net/~ruspen/Pics/Engine_Compartment2_40.JPG]

noelfisher_old · December 1, 2006 at 8:55 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

A rust free 44,000 mile car I'd be tempted to do nothing to it other than maintenance and aquiring some of the correct parts that may be gone. Unrestored can be good!

Hmmm.... you bring up a very good point. Do you think I should just clean it up in the engine bay and not paint? The only parts I see that need replacing are the following:

1. Alternator

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

I'd keep that alternator if it's original. Even if you buy a new one, I'd have the original reconditioned and detailed.

2. Windshield washer bag and hose

3. Battery (proper one)

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

Careful of the acid-type batteries... I've heard horror stories about them exploding after a few years and maiking a mess of nicely detailed engine compartments.

4. Clutch (Current one requires a gorilla to depress it)

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

I installed a Centerforce - so far, so good - much easier use.

5. Transmission (Current one is a RUG?)

6. Coil

7. Proper Cap and wires

8. Maybe the exhaust (has new exhaust but I am unsure if it is correct for the car)

9. Oil Pan (Someone put a modified pan with increased oil capacity)

10. Remove long tube headers and install original headers that came with the car.

I think that is the only parts I would have to purchase and/or replace. Believe it or not it still has the original radiator cap. Maybe a new cap would be needed. <img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Thanks... Gary

garymcgowan_old · December 1, 2006 at 9:42 PM

Ron,

Yeah, but man you have a much better looking engine and bay than I do. I hope to have that change by the weekend but I think it will be hard to match yours. Very nice.

One question about the 3 duces. Is the middle carb supposed to have an automatic choke? Can you post a pic of that side of your engine?

Thanks,

Gary

garymcgowan_old · December 1, 2006 at 9:50 PM

Noel,

Thanks for the tips. I'm not sure if the alternator is original or not. Was told that it was but I have yet to verify that. As for the battery I was thinking of ordering one from CJ Pony and just use it for show. Not sure that is a good idea but I was thinking of leaving the acid out and just mount the battery for show. Never been a participant at a show and don't know if I can do that.

Gary

garymcgowan_old · December 1, 2006 at 9:57 PM

Ron.... couple more questions if I may. Can you also show me a pic of the temp sending unit on your K? Mine temp gague is inop and I'm trying to trouble shoot it. Isn't it supposed to be elect. gagues?

Will the stock hood clear the 3 duces? If it does it has to be a tight fit.

Thanks,

Gary

noelfisher_old · December 1, 2006 at 10:54 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

As for the battery I was thinking of ordering one from CJ Pony and just use it for show. Not sure that is a good idea but I was thinking of leaving the acid out and just mount the battery for show. Never been a participant at a show and don't know if I can do that.

I have one with no acid... I will not take a chance on the engine compartment. I prepped it and had it painted three times before I was satisfied. There are plenty of people who do exactly as you describe - take a correct looking one to a show with you. I sold my house, but once I get a new house and garage, I think the battery will look nice sitting on a bench - my kind of sculpture.

BTW, there is an engine compartment detailing thread on this site that you can search for. Here is a link to one at Vintage-Mustang:

http://links.vintage-mustang.com/FAQ/engine_com…_detailing.html

Edited by - noelfisher on 12/01/2006 22:56:18

Beagle1_old · December 2, 2006 at 8:42 AM

Gary, here is the other side of the engine. Back in the 60's the Trip's came with an automatic heater riser type choke. They had a little stamped steel shroud that attached to the LH exh man and a tube that ran up to the choke.

Now I fabricated my own manual choke set up using all Holley parts. Some people really get creative and do odd things. My favorite is using the choke backwards. So when your driving around the cable is pulled out. UGH! Why? Mine uses the stock cable and works the proper way. Though I have never needed the choke? Yet others go electric...not era correct, so I have to deny that idea. And others will get a really long cable and wrap it around the front of the engine.

[Blocked Image: http://home.comcast.net/~ruspen/Pics/E…partment_40.JPG]

Here is a GREAT SITE and a heck of a nice guy, there is a great pic of a restored Tri Power with the temp sending unit on the first page:

http://www.gerlecreek.com/documents/tptechnical.htm

Retired USN Commander Brattland knows Tri Power! He helped me out a lot. And his book is a great investment. Worth 10x the cost.

The stock hood will clear the Tri Power as long as you don't have any spacer plates. Many people back in the 60's installed Moroso or other brands of spacers to isolate the heat from the carbs. I have found that driving around on the center carb heats up the fuel in the other two carbs, then when you get on it hard it runs poorly until fresh cool fuel gets into the front & rear bowls.

If I keep my Kar I will be spacing the carbs up. If i have to sell it this spring (currently unemployed and NOT looking promising), I will sell the Tri Power seperate and install the stock hood.

You will notice TWO temp senders in my pics. The one in the T/Stat housing goes to an electric SW temp gauge. So I have a sender pre & post T/Stat. I also have a mechanical Oil Press gauge. That is the black with red stripe hose you can see on the LH side. It looks old, but it's the Aeroquip super light hose. I choose it because it blends in under the hood.

Edited by - Beagle1 on 12/02/2006 08:46:54

garymcgowan_old · December 3, 2006 at 7:08 PM

Ron, Thanks for the link. It would probably be next to impossible to find the parts necessary to install the original choke but I did find this nice little piece from Holly and being sold by Summit. It allows you to hook up a manual choke to the 2300C in lieu of the automatic.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Hol…sspagenameZWD1V

This one allows you to convert the heat actuated choke to be fully electronic:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Hol…sspagenameZWD1V

Check these out and let me know your opinion about which one you would recommend using.

Gary

Beagle1_old · December 3, 2006 at 9:08 PM

Tell you what Gary, you buy the 1st one, the mechanical choke kit.

Send it to me, and I will copy mine for you free of charge and send it back to you. Then you can use the proper K code choke cable, and the choke will work properly. I can take a better pic of mine with the air cleaner off later this evening and post up the pic when I get a chance. Then you can see the whole thing, and possibly even copy it yourself. There's nothing to it when you have enough parts.

You parts will be safe if I were to do it, ask Dunc289, he can vouch for me as well as Chucks302. I have delt with both of them in the past.

Participate now!