Hi,
New to the forum, and need some help identifying part specifications.
One area is the driveshafts on C-4 cars. As noted in my blog http://mustangcodex.blogspot.com/2010/10/driveshaft.html I would expect there to be a different length and part number, but there's no reference in the 65-72 Master Parts Catalog. Is there a specification?
Another area I'm working on next is the front springs, and the specification for the K-code C-4 combination seems to be missing there, as well...?
Pete
Pete, I will not be home until Wednesday to look this up in my books however I am pretty sure that the 4 speed and C4 share the same driveshaft with a Hipo. The Hipo is shorter than a standard 289 due to the 9 inch rear end. I will look the springs up when I get home if this has not been resolved by then however I am pretty sure that the springs are the same for a 4 speed and C4 Hipo car. They used the same heavy duty springs as a GT equipped standard 289 car.
-Fred-
Thanks, Fred.
I would expect a different driveshaft length due to the different length of the C-4 itself, as seen in the difference of manual and automatic C & A code driveshafts - but maybe I'm wrong<img src=images/icon_smile_question.gif border=0 align=middle>
What are the books you are referring to that would carry such information?
Pete, I have a lot of references including a Ford master parts catalog that has not been updated since 1970 which makes it have a lot of the numbers and specifications that are absent in the later versions. I was a Ford parts manager for twenty years so these books make perfect sense to me. Again, I will look this stuff up when I return home on Wednesday.
-Fred-
Ford MPC shows driveshaft length (between U-joint centers) for standard 289s with 3-speed or 4-speed as 50-25/32", and for C4 as 51-1/16". That is a difference of 9/32" (not much -- about 1/4"). The 289 HiPo with 3-speed or 4-speed (3-speed?) was listed as 50-7/64". The 289 HiPo with C4 was not listed.
That's what the books say. I can tell you there are plenty of errors in applications, so sometimes best to go on the math, which suggests that the C4 driveshaft was 9/32" longer than the one for the 4-speed. So, I would expect that the proper length for the 289 HiPo with C4, if it were listed, would have been 50-25/64". Only way to know for sure is for someone with an original 66 Mustang HiPo automatic to measure the driveshaft.
To throw more mud in the air, in other applications where the C4 and 4-speed are dimensionally the same as the Mustang, The 1965 Falcon shows a difference between C4 and 4-speed as 11/32" (C4 longer), whereas the 1966-67 Fairlane shows the same length for both, as does the 1967 Mustang.
I have a January 1966 Ford parts and accessories manual that shows a length of 49.70 for the 289 4/B Special with a part # of C5ZZ-4602-E. The 289 2/B and 4/B C4 trans prem fuel shows a length of 51.06 part # C5ZZ-4602-H. The manual shows 200 cuin., 289 2/B and 289 4/B manual 3 and 4 spd trans as having a length of 50.78 with a part # of C5ZZ-4602-J. It didn't show a different length for the C4 drive shaft used with the HiPo engine in the Mustang. I hope this helps.
Thanks for looking, guys.
When I started the build sheet decoding process, and constructed the driveshaft table, like Bob, I expected there to be a separate entry for the Hipo with C-4. Then it seems it was ignored again now that I've moved on to the front spring table. Curious...
Richard,
The 1966 manual matches the part numbers from my version, but uses decimal inches instead of fractional?
I've found a reference that suggests there were two types of C-4's used in '66.
Type I with shift ratios of:
First 2.46:1 Second 1.46:1 Third 1.00:1 Reverse 2.20:1
And Type II with shift ratios of:
First 2.40:1 Second 1.47:1 Third 1.00:1 Reverse 2.00:1
I believe that Type I was used on all T, C, and A codes, and wonder if Type II was used on K's? I've been reading here where the internals (valve body for one) were different in the HiPo C-4 and wonder if this resulted in a different set of shift ratios? 4-speeds seemed to differ with a closer ratio used in the Hipo.
There is nothing in the Ford MPC to suggest any gear ratio differences between 1966 V8 C4s. The HiPo had a lighter secondary governor valve, two control valve spring changes, two enlarged holes in the separation plate, and a larger "C" servo. Otherwise, it was the same as the other V8 C4s.
Bob,
I checked out the MPC too, and could find only one planetary reference (suggesting one set of gear ratios).
The information I cited above was taken from Colin Date's Original Mustang 1964-1/2 through 1966, pg. 109. No source was cited for his tables. Urban myth perhaps?
According to my build sheet the Drive Shaft on a 66 Hipo Mustang with a C4 (Trans 6) was H.
Thanks, Mark!
This adds another piece to my build sheet code puzzle. If you believe you have the original driveshaft in the Kar, would it be possible to get some dimensions off it? Diameter and length.
Pete
Ok, it looks like the diameter is 2 3/4", but that's rounding up. I can't find my caliper for some reason, but the circumference using a pipe gauge is 8.63309. The length measure out to what appears to be 50 27/32". I used two plumb weights to mark off dead center on the floor. Then measured the distance. Does that help any?
Edited by - markforsythe on 02/18/2011 16:55:37
Mark,
Thanks for the measurements! We need to verify your rear gears before I can accept the driveshaft length as common to all K-code with C-4 combinations. Your build sheet codes for your rear gears are different than any other I have on file, and the length of the driveshaft would have been a function of the transmission and rear axle combination. Most times the rear end ratio doesn't play a role in determining the length. I would expect no difference in a driveshaft for 3:50 gears as compared to 3:89. But your codes are so unusual, it wouldn't hurt to confirm the rear gears.
Don’t have an account yet? Register yourself now and be a part of our community!
