Rally pac clock

1st Official Post

    Gentlemen

    Can someone please say 100% whether a 13 April 1965 low profile rally pac clock would have a number 6 on the dial or would it be missing ?

    Thanks

    • Official Post

    Jack, your Kar has a standard interior and therefore uses a high profile Rally Pac. The pictures of your Kar show a high profile Rally Pac which will have the 6 on it. All of the high profile Rally Pacs have the 6. The low profile Rally Pacs are meant for cars with the 5 dial instrumentation which in 1965 was only on GT or pony interior cars. All 1966 Mustangs had the 5 dial instrument cluster and were intended to have the low profile Rally Pac as an option. I have a few low profile Rally Pacs and all of them do not have the 6 as the clock setting stem goes right through where the 6 would be. They do have the 18 above the stem.


    -Fred-

    65 Koupe early San Jose Phoenician Yellow 4 speed
    66 GT Koupe Dearborn Blue 4 speed
    66 KGT San Jose fastback pony interior Silver Frost 4 speed
    64 Falcon sedan delivery 289 4 speed
    65 Ranchero 289 4 speed
    66 Corvette roadster 427/425 4 speed

    Fred, thanks for the clarification. So, since Mark's kar is a GT it should have the low profile without the 6 on the clock.

    Not to steal this thread, but I have noticed that some rally pac tac's have "FORD" and some have "MUSTANG" printed on the face. Is this a factory change and which is correct for a 65? Mine has "FORD" at the top.

    Jack

    Jack,


    I think the common concensus is the High Profile "Mustang" lettered Rally Pacs were factory installed or specifically ordered for Mustangs. While the "FORD" lettered High Profile Rally Pacs were the over the counter parts department Rally Pac that could be used on any FoMoCo vehicles of the era - Falcons, Rancheros, etc.


    I found my High Profile 8 grand "FORD" Rally Pac on a very early '66 A code coupe. It had to be added later since it is not what the factory would have installed on a 5 dial cluster car in '65 or '66. I have no way to tell for sure, but this car was highly optioned - factory AC, PS, Pony interior, seat belt warning light, vinyl top, console, and 4 speed - so I bet the original buyer had this installed by the dealer at purchase. This car now belongs to my daughter, but the Rally Pac will go into my '65 K when it is finished.


    I also think the term "Rally Pac" applied mostly to Mustang versions (center plate) and the Ford version had a blank plate, but don't quote me on this. My Ford version has the blank center, but others may have versions with the Rally Pac center.


    Edited by - RalphJr on 08/13/2009 11:09:59

    Fred

    I see you say all of your low profile clocks do not have a 6. I will try to add something I found on repairers site which says early '65 low profile clocks had the 6.


    Early 1965 Mustangs with the "Low Profile" rally pac (used in 1965 on special Hi-Perf Mustangs) had the same clock face as the 1965 "High Profile" rally pacs. Later, "Low Profile" rally pacs used on the 1965 Hi-Perf models had the same clock face as the 1966 "Low Profile" rally pacs, used entirely in 1966. In 1966 the "High Profile" rally pac was discontinued. Notice the stem on the early 1965 "Low Profile" rally pac and the "High Profile" rally pac did not negate the "6" o'clock numeral printed on the clock face, but the later 1965-66 "Low Profile" rally pac clock did not have the "6" screen printed on the dial." Also, the 1966 yellow second hand was used on the early and late 1965 rally clocks & all 1966 clocks.


    Unfortunatly the pic did not come out, whats your take on this, 6 or not?

    Thanks Mark


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    Edited by - cobraboy on 08/13/2009 12:05:08

    • Official Post

    Mark, that is very informative. We can always learn something new on this site with the wealth of knowledge that our members share.


    -Fred-

    65 Koupe early San Jose Phoenician Yellow 4 speed
    66 GT Koupe Dearborn Blue 4 speed
    66 KGT San Jose fastback pony interior Silver Frost 4 speed
    64 Falcon sedan delivery 289 4 speed
    65 Ranchero 289 4 speed
    66 Corvette roadster 427/425 4 speed

    Fred

    I guess I need a six then

    Cheers Mark

    Jack, Ralph thanks for the info on this

    Mark

    The reason for all this sixery is I am going to ask Phil Severence to build me an original clock as I have a quartz one and I would like it correct. Yes I know it wont keep time and it will lump and jerk but hey the rest of the car does that and I dont particularly feel the need to arrive on time when I'm in my car, I just enjoy being in there!


    Edited by - cobraboy on 08/13/2009 14:28:18


    Edited by - cobraboy on 08/13/2009 14:37:09

    I am still mulling this over.

    What do you guys consider to be early and late in terms of production date.

    If the production year starts in August, would Aug to Jan be early, and Feb to july be late ?. As I have been caught out on this before.

    Or does early / late refer to the calender year?

    Thanks


    Edited by - cobraboy on 08/15/2009 09:01:54

    Mark,


    In this case you need to consider the "age" of the options rather than the model year.


    In Feb, Mar, and April '65 the GT and Pony options were brand new - as some of the parts/options that went with them - like the low profile Rally Pac.


    Since your car is an April build I would say you are safer with the early style "6" clock.


    Think of it this way.....Ford was always using parts to depletion. If the high profile Rally Pac was being phased out at the end of '65 and the low profile ramped up in spring '65 makes sense that Ford would use up the older clocks anyway they could before moving to the new clocks OR if they started a new design they would use parts they had on hand to get a part into production quicker before a re-design of a part was ready. This is a very standard production process for any company - I do this all the time in my job!


    You only have to look at the variety of part changes between '64 1/2 and '65 model years to see this......may early designs continued well into the '65 model year before being changed - like the 2 speed to 3 speed heater fan change - many people think of this as a 64 1/2" feature, but I think it actually was used into Feb or Mar '65.


    HOWEVER - I doubt any judge in a show would notice this - but I do understand your desire to "get it right".


    My 2 cents!


    Ralph

    • Official Post

    Mark, this is purely an opinion but I believe that in this case it will make sense. Ralph has stated it very well in his post which he made while I was writing this post. This low profile Rally Pac was not used until the GT and pony interior option was available which was on the first anniversary of the Mustang production on April 17, 1965. These cars were obviously produced slightly before that but no Rally Pacs for these would have been in the publics hands before this date. Therefore, to me, an early low profile Rally Pac car would be from April 17, 1965 to sometime prior to the end of 1965 production. This would place your Kar into the early production.


    -Fred-

    65 Koupe early San Jose Phoenician Yellow 4 speed
    66 GT Koupe Dearborn Blue 4 speed
    66 KGT San Jose fastback pony interior Silver Frost 4 speed
    64 Falcon sedan delivery 289 4 speed
    65 Ranchero 289 4 speed
    66 Corvette roadster 427/425 4 speed

    Ralph, Fred

    Thank you for your thoughts which of course make perfect sense. As I said I keep getting caught out when ordering parts that are listed by 'early or late' lack of knowledge on my part.

    This car of mine will never be a concours or show car because in the UK we do not really have the show structure set up like you guys over there so its a bit like being all dressed up but nowhere to go.

    However my pleasure is derived from having something that is close to how it was made and as I am only another of a long line of owners this car has had to endure I dont want to be the one who screwed it up.

    But I will still DRIVE it and have FUN !!!

    Everyones help on here is amazing.

    Feel the need to offer this to your discussion - my "K" has a build date of April 22, Dearborn plant, VIN 5F09K701583. It was ordered for the son of the owner of Hawkinson Ford, Chicago and must have been ordered before the publid ever got a glipse of the Ponyand GT packages. Seems to have been ordered with all options possible, Pony, Tinted Glass, SSW. Visibility package, "K" engine.console, so I "think" that the rally pac is original. It does NOT have the "6" on the dial. Not sure if this info helps or hinders your decision. For what it is worth I am the third owner and the car was virtually untouched when I purchased it in 84

    He He thanks john.

    Ok what happens when you guys change your clocks to quartz movements, do you transplant the whole thing, face, hands, dial, button etc or do you have to take all these off the mechanical movement and move them over to the quartz. If they are transplanted then the chances are that the dial I have on the quartz movement is the original one ( which by the way does not have a 6 )

    I am not on my home computor so do not have access to all of my umages, is your car a GT with a low profile pac?


    Edited by - cobraboy on 08/15/2009 15:55:53

    Thank you John

    I have delved further, I turned up a mustang monthly tech page on how to convert to quartz and guess what, the hands. face, button etc have to be transplanted from the mechanical movement to the quartz. I have the yelow second hand so I have to assume that the original equipment got transfered so I will use it on the 'new' mechanical clock. Just dont expect me to turn up on time <img src=images/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

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