What are matching #'s

Geez......you have started a discussion now. This reminds me of the Corvette forum and the "matching numbers" controversy that GM people have been discussing for years. Everyone will have a different opinion of what matching numbers refer to. <img src=images/icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

Based on what we've all seen on eBay and other auctions, matching numbers are when DOLLARS PAID >= RESERVE PRICE which usually means that you paid too much.

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I think that if all parts are date correct and the body is straight with no rust or repairs then you have a great K. IMHO

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I fully agree. I think most of us would agree that date codes within a particular range, coupled with features that match the door tag make sense. Having a VIN on the block that matches the car is very desirable but I'd bet that almost 50% of the cars don't have that anymore. 40 years is a long time in a car's life, so it is a good thing they made lots of Mustangs so a few would survive. I happen to be patching my rear fender aprons to retain the original stampings, rather that replace them and make new stampings. That's a whole other debate that I don't want to touch - retaining history versus restoring to concourse. Opinions are like a--holes, there are lots of them in every crowd & everyone has one. Best to just enjoy our cars, whatever path we take.

I agree with what Lyle has said and think there are a couple of answers to the matching numbers question.

Matching Numbers: Based on all that we know Ford tried to put the VIN on the high performance cars in 5 places: three stampings on the inner fenders, the motor and the trans. Some cars lack VINs on the motors or the transmissions, but given the age of the cars that's not surprising if something was replaced along the way. However; for a car to have matching numbers it really should have all 5 vehicle identification numbers.

Matching Date Codes: Having the date codes match is equally important, but a car can have matching vehicle ID numbers and still lack matching date codes. Body parts, engine components, etc. get changed through the years with service replacement parts. The car may not be date code correct, but if they are Ford service parts the car is fundmentaly all Ford.

I know that my car has all 5 VINs, but there has been some minor body work done with Ford service parts that aren't date code correct. I'm not losing any sleep over it, and I'm not tearing the car apart looking for earlier parts to replace the later date codes I found. I view Ford service replacement parts as part of the history of the car. Someone made the effort to obtain a Ford part when something wore out along the way.

The restoration of lost or missing VIN numbers on fenders, motors and transmissions is definitely another topic.

It took me awhile to find a K that suited my needs. I initially thought that if I could get a car that was matching numbers car - 3 inner fender VIN's, motor, trans - great. But 1st on the priority list was the body to be undoubtly correct and original with all vin's. If I found a car that could have been 100% verified as matching numbers - that would have been a bonus.

Some had matching driveline numbers, but had accident damage and missing inner fender VINs, or was supposed to be all matching but ended up being very suss!

I ended up with a K that has a magnificent body with an unrestored undercarriage, all VINS are present and original. I didnt buy the car as "matching numbers" - No VIN is on the block and the block date code is 5 months before the build of the car so I'd say not a "matching numbers" car, but all hipo parts are present.

At the end of the day it was more important for me to have a correct body, with original VIN's and no bodgy rust or accident damage repairs. I persoanlly wouldnt pay a premium for matching numbers unless you are nearly 100% sure the car is what it supposed to be.

All the best over the festive season to you all!

Edited by - Rohan on 12/22/2006 14:15:24

I'll chime in. In the simplest sense, I think matching numbers means that body has its original block and tranny housing. Everything else can be sourced. While the body condition is important, that too can be changed/corrected. But, once that original block and tranny case are gone, the car is no longer numbers matching. Ultimately, as has been alluded to, the marketplace decides what is numbers matching and what is worth a premium.

My car is numbers matching (by my definition), but has had a couple of panel changes and some rust repair. I don't think these changes detract from value as significantly as a missing motor or tranny or body vins would.

However, I will say that if someone goes through the trouble of re-creating a car with all of the "correct" parts and does an excellent job, then there is no reasong that the car shouldn't approach the value of an equivalent numbers matching car. This is assuming that the body is an original K body and can be verified.

If able would someone describe exactly where to look for the VIN's? I am able to find three (driver side inner fender, block, transmission) but unable to find the other two.

Thanks

Damon,

The second VIN on the driver side nearest the windshield is typically covered by the top of the fender. The number that is running perendicular to the VIN is the date code of the fender panel.

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Dave,

Thanks for posting the pictures, they answered all my questions! I had looked all over for the "remaining" numbers to no avail. It never dawned on me they would be hidden by the fender lip or just slightly visible from the wheel well. I have read the 4th edition K code book and it's not clear or I'm just a tad slow...

Thanks,

Damon

I have a 64 1/2 K Cp in my shop with only 1 VIN (left front apron) stamping with all original sheet metal..