Agree about the leaving early thing, saw that happen at Indy too. People are going to start getting disqualified if they keep it up.
Nice to see everyone at the show, glad you had a good time!
Posts by CharlesTurner
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They were intended to be on all cars at all plants.
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Usually to the left of the solenoid, but has been found in other locations around the solenoid.
For your Dearborn car, the specific gravity would be written in, like 1.250 or 1.275, the date stamp would be of format "MAR 15, 1965". Inspector mark might be punched through the paper, hand-written or an ink stamp.
Here's a pic of an original decal from I believe a June '65 Dearborn car:
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You might try putting the original pad out in the sun for a few hours and then install it. You might be able to pull the corners down enough to get the trim on. Worth a shot to try at least once.
Otherwise, your options are to locate an NOS one or dye an original or NOS one.
The radio speaker grille and the moldings should be the same color, which will be a close match to the color of the dash pad.
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Quote from jr.S
You are absolutely correct. Some things said were out of line, but the constant negativity from others creates tension about the whole subject. I post pictures to share with people what i've found on this San Jose car in hopes that someone would find the information useful. I have thousands of pictures of this car including markings found upon disassembly, pictures of reassembly and such. One of the reasons i don't post more than i do is because of the negativity and dislike that i have recieved since first joining this site.
You have a total of 33 posts on this site. I went back and read through every one of them since you joined here and could not find one single remark made in a negative tone towards you or your car. By all accounts, information was graciously provided to you whenever you had questions. I also read that in February, that you posted about the carpet, asking if a coupe carpet would fit in your fastback. I responded that you could buy the correct carpet from Va. Mustang. Several months later, you purchase a coupe carpet anyway.
J.R., any negativity that you perceive from this forum or from me personally must be something that you've come up with on your own. I was the person that explained to you what the car was and gave you tons of unconditional information. It was exciting to know the first unit SJ car had been found and on top of that was a hi-po fastback... very cool. Even though your only motivation in talks with me was determining the value of the car, I still gave you answers to all your questions. Only thing I can think of is that some of my answers were not to your liking. Also, if you remember, I was the one that told you about this website and encouraged you to join and share information about the car. It sure feels like a slap in the face when I see this kind of attitude.
Even after your rude response, I still responded to your post in a well-thought, informative manner. Even though I said it was not my job to police the NPD catalog, I did go ahead and e-mail Scott Halseth and let him know the situation.
Honestly, this group of enthusiasts here are one of the best. The information on K codes is 2nd to none. I've gotten to know quite a few of the members here very well and have formed lifetime friendships. We all share a passion, even if the flavors are a little different here and there.
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The factory installed consoles I have seen were usually installed pretty well. I think I sent pics of the GT convertible console and how it fit, that cars' console was factory installed. Believe I even hit the original holes when I put it back in.
I understand that your car had some structural repairs done. Was the center double-hump section replaced? If so, it could account for the console being slightly off as new holes would have had to been made.
Nonetheless, should be able to adjust yours. If new holes are required, the old ones can be filled and touched up with primer color.
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I e-mailed Scott Halseth at NPD, he said they didn't get "fastback" on the carpet list in time for the '09 catalog, but will be in the next printing and customers can order it if requested. So, J.R., if you want the correct serge edge carpet for your fastback, you should be able to get it from NPD. They could probably take the coupe rear section in return. If "Russell", at NPD is unsure of this, tell him to call the Michigan store and speak to Scott (product manager for NPD.)
Regarding "restoration" of the car, knowing Jeff, it's a terminology thing. Since you're modifying the car, it really isn't a "restoration" as the definition of the word is defined. "Restoration", means returning to original state/condition, which you are not completely doing.
It's good that you have documented the car to a certain degree, that might help if whoever buys the car is interested in taking it back original. I'm sure folks here appreciate the drive shaft pics and things of that nature.
As we discussed on the phone and in e-mails, the only claim you can make regarding the VIN is that it is the first '65 San Jose car assigned a VIN. You have no documentation to prove when it was actually built or even if there were other fastbacks or K codes built before yours. I would strongly caution you against using the term "first", unless describing the car as the first unit number. Nonetheless, being the first unit number is significant, but please keep things honest. I'm sure Jim Smart would agree with this.
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HEH-T is the code for a close ratio Toploader used in '65 K code Mustangs. The 014114 is a build sequence number.
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Believe that M5 is the production/model year for the bumper. Not sure why bumpers were marked like that.
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I've had a few conversations with Rick about carpet and knew that the style of carpet in your car was the serge edge, or at least should have been. This meant it didn't apply to his situation. Didn't realize that I was insulting you by answering the question.
Regarding the carpet, I simply stated the facts about the early style. As for judging rules, it is also in the MCA rulebook. The reason it is stated as 64.5-early 65 is to allow some flexibility in the time period. While I have observed the serge carpet used as late as end of January '65, there could be more examples out there with later dates. Additionally, even if Ford published a crossover date, that could more or less just be an "intended" date in production that could have seen a little run over/under of the use of the product. Also, when dealing with multiple colors of carpet, it stands to reason that less popular colors would take longer to use up the supply.
Nobody here has said anything derogatory about how you are restoring the car, including myself. I bit my tongue when I saw the red engine bay, but that is your choice and I can respect that. You asked me what route you should take when you bought the car and I gave you my opinion. I remember spending quite a bit of time corresponding with you. It seemed like you were more concerned with the value of the car, depending on whether or not it was modified or concours. Even though I did not care for that attitude regarding this particular car, I still was cordial and gave my advice.
Not everyone prefers a concours-restored car and there is nothing wrong with that. I always say there is room in the hobby for everyone. The only thing I ever ask of anyone is to respect how I enjoy the hobby and I will respect your way. Do not belittle trailered/concours show cars, the people that own them enjoy them just as much as you enjoy your car.
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Just because you see something in a catalog does not make it right. Also, it is not my job to police the content of their catalogs and knowledge level of whoever answers the phone. This Russell person clearly has limited knowledge of carpet in 64.5-65 Mustangs. NPD usually is very good with their catalogs, but they got this one mixed up. I'm sure Scott will fix it next go around.
Not every vendor has this wrong in their catalog either, you should have done some more checking before making blanket statements. Virginia Mustang lists the serge edge carpet as correct for 64.5 - early 65, they have it for coupes, convertibles and fastbacks. The only difference in the convertible one is simply the absence of the toe pad. You could have ordered the correct carpet for your fastback from VA Mustang as I did for my January '65 K fastback. It does not come with a toe pad, as it shouldn't. All the original serge edge carpets I have seen had no toe pad.
I have seen the serge edge/no toe pad carpet used in Mustangs as far in '65 production as late January '65. A full 5 months of production use would hardly make this style carpet exclusively "64.5" carpet.
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If you haven't done so already, I would suggest you get a Marti report for the car, http://www.martiauto.com This will tell you how your car came equipped. With only 50 '67 K convertibles ever made, you will maximize the value of the car by putting it back like it was new.
Regarding your questions about options... pretty sure P/S was optional on a '67 K code. Automatic transmissions were available.
I don't recall the drive shaft specs. Probably find that in the MPC or the 4th edition hi-po mustang book (which you should be able to purchase off the main page here.)
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The serge edge carpet was used as late as February '65. It really shouldn't be considered "64.5" carpet.
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Nice looking car! I bet that turns a few Briton heads when you put it on the road!
Do you know a fellow named Jeremy Davies in the London area? Has a yellow '66 convertible and a '68 GT350 fastback. Jeremy was kind enough to give me a ride in his '66 when I was in London last.
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That's the early '65 style carpet with serge edges, only have to trim front and back. I have one of these, but would have to check the box to be sure that it was ACC.
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Might help to post a pic. Can look it up in the MPC later.
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Same questions for the 2/65 one...
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Off a '67 K code or a service item.
Edit: Most likely a service item, the 7B date is probably February 1977.
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Search tool will yield lots of info here:
For example:
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Charcoal Black was first used in Mustangs started with the 1967 model. Your car should be plain semi-gloss black.
